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Why Embracing Slash is Good for Everybody

Mark Ruffalo and Robert Downey Jr. in "The Avengers"

Mark Ruffalo and Robert Downey Jr. in “The Avengers”

In the world of fan art, if you can imagine it, it probably already exists: a Lupin/Snape romance, evil My Little Ponies on dates, and even “Science Bros,” the meme in which Tony Stark and Bruce Banner hang out, do some science, and have a little PG-13 bromance on the side.

At a recent event, a reporter showed The Avengers star Mark Ruffalo a series of drawings of his character snuggling with Robert Downey Jr.’s Tony Stark. He began giggling, and then even made up captions for one of the cartoons, “Would you like a gummy worm?” Better yet, he told the reporter, “I endorse [this art] 100 percent. You know what it is? It’s open-source creativity.”

Ruffalo isn’t the first actor to embrace fan depictions of same-sex pairings that never happened on screen (better known as “slash”). Benedict Cumberbatch and Martin Freeman apparently checked out Tumblr sites full of fan art depicting their Sherlock characters in some compromising scenes. Cumberbatch says he’s “flattered” and “amazed by the level of artistry.”

Fan fiction and fan art have existed in their modern form since at least since the 1960s, when Star Trek devotees began publishing their stories in fan zines (with real paper!). These stories were sometimes erotic, sometimes not. In 1981, Lucasfilm sent a letter to fans advising them to stop writing “X-rated” stories using its Star Wars characters; it’s difficult to imagine a studio today attempting to rein in the massive amount of original content that fans upload daily to the Internet. For better or worse, the people who make movies have had to accept that the people who don’t make movies are going to create their own art, stories and romances to fill in the gaps between sequels and prequels. There’s really no stopping it.

Dylan O'Brien as Stiles, left, and Tyler Hoechlin as Derek on "Teen Wolf"

Dylan O’Brien as Stiles, left, and Tyler Hoechlin as Derek on “Teen Wolf”

So why not embrace slash? We’re past the days when the implication that an actor is portraying (or is in real life) a gay man would ruin a career. In fact, Entertainment Weekly suspected Downey repeatedly referenced homoerotic subtext during his press junket for 2009’s Sherlock Holmes to try to create buzz around the film (upsetting the Arthur Conan Doyle estate in the process). Homoerotic fan art might be a new signal that you’ve arrived in Hollywood. People know your face (and your abs) well enough to do 30 sketches of you embracing another star.

But cynicism aside, fan art and fan fiction have helped gays and lesbians to express themselves in genres in which gay and lesbian characters are few and far between. There wasn’t going to be a gay Avenger in the 2012 movie. Sherlock and Watson are not going to hook up in the Moffat series. If you are a gay man who love science fiction and superheroes, you won’t see yourself reflected in too many of your favorite movies. It’s not that the fan-art creators are necessarily gay themselves, but they are imagining a wider range of possible character relationships than most Hollywood executives would ever greenlight.

In August, MTV launched a contest for the best fanfic stories based on its Teen Wolf drama that was openly inclusive of slash pairings, including “Sterek,” the popular pairing of Stiles and Derek. The cable network is doing something great here, embracing the fans they have rather than fighting to maintain control over their stories and characters.

The fans who read subtext into every look and gesture of two male characters aren’t a threat to a show’s integrity. After all, they’re probably some of the most loyal viewers out there. Hollywood can’t stop these fans, so actors and studios might as well sit back and have a gummy worm.

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Comments

  • turd alberts

    I wonder what would happen if there was a high profile story about gay characters being portrayed as straight in fan fiction. Would that be viewed with the same open mindedness, or would people be up in arms that a heteronormative society is un-gaying (a term of my own creation) and thereby bastardizing beloved gay characters. Regardless of orientation I think it is weird to sexualize characters like this. These are after all, characters, not people. They are deliberately 2 dimensional, I want to know who Sherlock is effing as much as I want to know what kind of risotto he eats.

  • Robert

    I find it amusing because I’d never have thought that there was any “subtext” to the Banner/Stark dynamic. Did fans of gay subtext miss all the ass grabbing between Stark and Potts (Paltrow)? What would make more sense to me is a Hulk/Thor subtext. There is obvious tension there.

    I will say that in regards to Sherlock Holmes, that any sort of “gay” subtext seriously misses the point of that character. Holmes was a virtual alien intellect/persona and clearly asexual.

  • http://www.facebook.com/people/Jason-A-Quest/100000875744905 Jason A. Quest

    Queer people are so accustomed to implied-gay and possibly-gay characters in the media being “straightened” by nervous studio execs, that I don’t think most of us would blink if we saw fans doing it. Plus, we tend to be a *bit* more open-minded about the notion that sexuality is … complicated. Pardon the promotional plug, but that’s one of the themes covered in an upcoming book I’m contributing a story to, called “Anything That Loves”: sexuality can be a wibbly-wobbly phenomenon. http://anythingthatloves.com

  • Liz

    Have you missed that bisexuality exists?

  • Liz

    Actors knowing about slash fiction (and fanfiction in general) isn’t exactly new, neither is them being accepting of it, although it’s nice to see more high profile actors being involved (although anyone who’s surprised that the actors know obviously didn’t see the photo of the Joss Whedon and Clark Gregg almost kiss that Gregg posted a while ago).

    Yay for actors/directors/etc. not being homophobic idiots!

    Embrace the slash fans. Most of the ones I know are a lot more loyal to shows, comics and films that casual fans who don’t write fanfiction.

  • Turd Alberts

    What a shameless plug ;) You are talking about implied sexual orientation, I am talking about explicit. It is one thing to nudge an ambiguous character one way or another and another to change it completely. I was talking more about an “out” character like from Glee. I think your idea that Queer people are more tolerant is a big assumption. I am speaking only from my own experience with gay people showing some real intolerances towards bi in my own life (admittedly anecdotal evidence). I personally do not think it would go over as well as you do. I am talking about reactions of people outside of the fan fiction community, my guess is that within the community no one really cares about any changes people make.

  • Liz

    “Regardless of orientation I think it is weird to sexualize characters like this” The characters from the comics originate from a medium where female characters are regularly drawn in ridiculous clothing and poses to show off their breasts and butts. Characters in slash fiction are probably less sexualised than the female characters in the original material.

    Is it the fact that they are two men that makes you uncomfortable?

  • Turd Alberts

    On the subject of women’s portrayal in comics; sex as orientation is different than sex as gender or sex as a way to exploit. I would say that my comments about orientation do not apply to how women are portrayed in terms of costume. I do think that what you quoted me on could be applied to that as well. I know my comments might lump me into a certain group of people, but I can assure you that I am not homophobic. I never said that the images make me uncomfortable, I said it, it being the sexualization of characters not the images themselves, is weird.

  • Turd Alberts

    “Yay for actors/directors/etc. not being homophobic idiots!”

    So, if you do not embrace something someone does to your character you are homophobic? I guess the idea that a person just genuinely does not want their character to be manipulated in a way that goes against their artistic vision is bigoted. I ask that sincerely, not to troll. I agree that it is great that Mark Ruffalo has a sense of humor and is encouraging of peoples hobbies, I don’t think it is great to automatically label those who aren’t encouraging of it as homophobes. I think that it is a pretty polarizing stance to have.

  • Johnny Sarcastic

    I long for the days that sexuality and sex and all that comes with it wasn’t dinner table conversation; that you couldn’t see breasts on television before 11 PM. It seems to have become such an overriding and motivating factor for everybody regarding everything that … well, I dunno.

    I guess good for Mark Ruffalo and good for people who write this stuff?

  • aliablack

    But how does one define ambiguous? My friend K was married to her husband for 12 years. They have two children. It turned out that for at least 8 of those years, he had a gay lover and finally came out once she discovered his infidelity. They got divorced not long after. Gay men and women having heterosexual relationships is quite common for numerous reasons. And many are adept at hiding and/or denying their true sexuality. Some are homosexual, some are bi-sexual (and in fact I have several bi- friends who are married to men, some happily, some not-so-.

    But my point is that one can present as heterosexual and have heterosexual relationships while being bisexual or homosexual. (And in fact, one of the more upsetting anti-gay marriage arguments promotes this behavior.)

    Fans imagining beloved characters as being bisexual or even homosexual despite having blatant and explicit heterosexual relationships isn’t something that’s necessarily fantastical. It’s real for real people in their real lives after all.

    It’s not really that different in the scheme of things from imagining a character being involved with a different opposite sex character – i.e. in the Star Trek reboot, Spock and Uhura are a couple. Is it also “weird” for fans to imagine (and write/draw depictions of) Uhura dating Kirk instead? Or is it only “weird” if they imagine Kirk and Spock in a relationship?

    Also, you may not be interested in who the characters are romantically involved with, but plenty of other people are. (And will they-won’t they became a huge plot point of X-files with Mulder and Scully, even though the point of the show was solving mysteries. It’s a natural thing to wonder about relationships between people – fictional and non-.) Personal taste is, after all, very subjective.

  • aliablack

    No, it does not make one homophobic. But I think that creators of any art – actors, artists, musicians, directors, writer, etc. – have to come to terms with the notion that once they put something ‘out there’, other people aren’t necessarily going to interpret their work in the same way they intended when presenting it. That’s just the nature of the beast. People have different different views and interpretations, and they bring their own life experiences to everything they see, watch, read, or consume in general. Just like you might find some joke to be the funniest thing you ever heard, others might find it offensive or just not amusing at all. It’s why we can (and do!) disagree with film critics, art critics, book reviews.

    It’s when creators fail to acknowledge this notion – see Anne Rice as an example – that they run into trouble. It doesn’t automatically make them homophobic, no. Saying, “No, I don’t see that, nor did I intend that interpretation” is one thing. Railing screeds of “How dare you!” that might include … questionable language is quite another.

  • Jack

    Figures a woman would write this.

  • Turd Alberts

    Yes I agree that in real life there are plenty of instances where Gay men or women live life as heterosexuals. I imagine it must be incredibly painful for all involved, especially their partners. I loved X-files, If Mulder and Scully would have started dating it would have detracted from the show as a whole. I understand peoples wondering about relationships like that, what I don’t understand is the industry of fan fiction that has sprouted up around it. It has nothing to do with orientation, it has to do with the irrelevant sexualization of characters. My “weird” comment has to do with the tendency of fan fiction writers to sexualize characters. My comment specific to homosexuality was about how they might react if they shoe was on the other foot, so to speak. And even that was not meant in a spiteful way, just out of curiosity since, as other commenters have alluded to, if you don’t like that a fan fiction character is gay you are a homophobe, what does that mean if you don’t like that a gay character is turned straight in fan fiction.

    Maybe I am just a prude.

  • Thennary Nak

    I’m not sure if you can consider slash being all that great for the LGBT cause when a great deal of it is written/drawn by women for other women. While I am sure there are some that are men that participate in this part of fandom they are in the minority. Most likely because this is something that is more based in homoeroticism than homosexuality.

    I have been aware of slash since I was a teen and was in anime/manga fandoms. It goes under a different name there BL (Boys Love) or yaoi as it has become a genre in Japan with how much fan and original work that is produced of it over there. (The manga for gay men has its own genre, bara, which has a different look to it.) And it is widely known to be straight women creating it for other straight women with the look of it being typically the same as the style used in manga for girls and women. Very rarely do the issues that come with being homosexual get brought up and the focus is typically solely on romance and sex.

    While it seems more open to taking in issues of homosexuality slash does seem to have some of the same issues as BL. Though that might come from bleed over from the fandoms. Though there does seem to be the bonus in questionable trend in POC characters and actual gay characters being ignored to ship the hot straight white characters. Teen Wolf is a perfect example of this with the main character not being white yet the actor that plays him is always hanging around one of the actors in the Stereck which usually makes for easy shipping for slashers, yet it is the two straight white characters that have by far the greatest slash fanbase. The series has an openly gay character, but the vast amount of slash exclude him. And this is hardly the only series where this has happened in the slash fandom.

    Of course there are exceptions to this and I do not want to paint slash as all terrible, as there are some parts of it that can be helpful in discourse about sexuality and acceptance. But there are issues with it, as there also tends to be doses of misogyny thrown in as well and the fact that it is much rarer to see fans writing about female slash in comparison in addition to the issues I have already brought up.

  • Thennary Nak

    You do realize how sexist that statement is, right?

  • Turd Alberts

    Alia, I agree with your point to an extent. A creator cannot control how their works are interpreted. Fan fiction though goes beyond interpretation and into manipulation. I actually do understand how someone could watch avengers and interpret the banter between Stark and Banner as flirtatious, I would actually agree with that interpretation.

    I appreciate your answer of whether or not a person rejects the fan fiction classifies them as homophobic, but I feel like your comments are significantly different in tone than Liz’s.

    Also I am starting to regret my choice of screen name the more I comment.

  • tonton101

    I think you pretty much self-diagnosed yourself as painfully prudish. Consumers of literary works have long fantasized about the characters in their beloved books, and no doubt in sexual situations. Someone brought up Sherlock Holmes in an earlier comment and argued that Holmes was “asexual” in character. Be this as it may, Holmes various qualities (intelligence, wit, charm, gentlemenship, etc) could be perceived as “attractive” by readers and, in turn, lead to fans consuming Holmes as a sexual figure. Moreover, the sexualization of characters is merely one manifestation of fandom and, coincidentally, one of the more pertinent.

    I recommend reading Michael Saler’s, As If: Modern Enchantment and the Literary Pre-History of Virtual Reaity, for an enthralling look at fandom’s storied history.

  • tonton101

    It has nothing to do with finding any real or perceived subtext, but everything to do with the way in which fans consume and interpret the works that enthrall them. A character will obviously deviate from its authorial intent but that is the nature of fandom and is the greatness of fandom — new and unique creations spawned from the desires of fans.

  • http://www.facebook.com/people/Alan-Alexander/502988241 Alan Alexander

    “Supernatural” had a great take on slash fiction. Within the “Supernatural” universe, the two main characters (Sam and Dean Winchester) are a pair of monster-hunting brothers, whose exploits have been turned into a popular series of horror novels eagerly read by fans who didn’t know that the stories were true. A few seasons back, the brothers attended a fan convention and were horrified to learn not just that fanfic writers had slashed them into an incestuous relationship, but that there was even a name for it: Wincest!

  • aliablack

    :) We’ve been sexualizing characters for centuries. Humans are sexual creatures so of course it’s going to be depicted in our art and also in our hobbies. What has changed, I think, is the degree to which these ideas have become more public and shared, thanks to technology. Also that they’re being embraced as more mainstream. (The Avenue Q song “The Internet is For Porn” is pretty on-target.) It’s freeing and a relief, to be frank, to realize that you’re not a pariah for having thoughts and ideas that were mostly shunned or just kind of kept on the ‘down low’ not so long ago.

    As for the shoe being on the other foot, I think that there are (still) so few positive gay portrayals in art and media arts, especially in comparison to heterosexual portrayals, that when a gay character is imagined/portrayed straight – it’s not that it’s wrong exactly, in the same way it’s not wrong to imagine/portray a nominally straight character as homosexual – it just comes off as marginalizing an already marginalized group of individuals. It’s not so much the essence as the appearance, if that makes sense.

    Regarding “if you don’t like that a fan fiction character is gay you are a homophobe, etc.” I don’t think that is homophobic in itself at all. What I think would be homophobic would be the reasons behind why one doesn’t like it. Is that reason because someone thinks it’s “icky” or is it because what that person has come to understand about the character make it improbable from their perspective? If that character is paired up in canon with an opposite-sex partner, and you simply prefer that pairing to the imagined homosexual relationship, again, that’s not homophobic. But again, it’s one thing to have your own preferences without railing against someone else’s in a negative way. To use X-files again, like preferring Mulder/Scully as a pairing to Mulder/Krycek without making derogatory comments about M/K.

    Of course fandom itself is hypocritical when it comes to what are known as “ship wars” (ship as in relationship) but that way lies a black hole of madness. :-P (Rather like the Yankees/Red Sox or other sports rivalries. Emotionally charged, not always logical, intense, and featuring a lot of mud-slinging and worse.)

    I also want to point out that fan fiction (and fanart) itself isn’t necessarily about sexualizing characters. Just like in any medium, there are tens of thousands of stories (and pictures) that have nothing to do with sex and relationships at all. The thing about fan fiction is that people love characters so much, they want to see them in other situations. Sometimes those other situations involve romantic relationships, other times it involves them having new adventures, or going shopping, or working in a coffee shop, or having adventures and going shopping and working in a coffee shop and having relationships in outer space. If you can imagine it, there’s very probably a story about it out there in some fandom.

    Nothing wrong with being a self-defined prude. :) We all have our own levels of comfort. I enjoy reading about sexual relationships, but there are certain situations and kinks that I find beyond my own comfort level, so I simply seek out the things I enjoy, and leave the other stuff to those who enjoy the things I don’t.

  • Robert

    I would have required at least one Tony Stark pat on the ass of Steve Rogers, hell, even of Rodney, to give the idea just cause for consideration.

  • Robert

    That’s fine, but if you’re a fan of Sherlock Holmes, injecting any kind of sexuality into the character, homosexual or heterosexual, comes dangerously close to losing the essential aspects of what makes the character interesting in the first place. I could write fan-fic portraying Holmes as a suave ladies man, but that would be ridiculous and I really couldn’t call myself a Sherlock Holmes fan in good conscious if I thought that that in some way improved the concept or even made the concept more palatable I’d really don’t think that would make me much of a fan. Of course parody is a different matter.

  • aliablack

    I’d say that for you, that is your perception of the character, and there’s nothing wrong with that. But to then say that others aren’t allowed to – or shouldn’t – be able to see the character in ways that you don’t, and that it’s wrong and means they’re not true fans is also wrong.

    You’re also ignoring the whole concept of “what if.” What if Holmes was homosexual and attracted to Watson? What if he were essentially asexual yet still felt an emotional attachment to Watson? Hell, what if Holmes was more James Bond-like? How would that affect his character? How would it manifest itself in his behavior and character? What would change?

    A significant portion of fanfiction stories specifically set out to explore these types (and other types) of “what if” scenarios. Why? Well, why not? That doesn’t make them wrong, nor does it make the fans any less true fans. It just means it’s not to your taste and isn’t something you’d be interested in. There’s nothing wrong with that, nor is there anything wrong with people wanting to explore other aspects or facets of a character.

  • Than05

    God help ANY celebrity once they discover 4chan.

  • Travis

    Kudos for an excellent article!

  • Cee

    “I’m not sure if you can consider slash being all that great for the LGBT cause when a great deal of it is written/drawn by women for other women.”

    Quite a lot of m/m slash is being written by LBTQA women; straight women are probably the majority of fanfiction writers, but there’s also a huge number of queer women in fandom. (Which brings up the complicated question of why so many queer women are choosing to write m/m slash, to which there don’t seem to be any definitive answers and I won’t attempt to address the issue here. Still, the point stands, women’s writing m/m slash can’t simply be categorized as straight people appropriating queer experiences, since many of those women are themselves queer.)

    “Though there does seem to be the bonus in questionable trend in POC characters and actual gay characters being ignored to ship the hot straight white characters.”

    Ignoring POC characters is definitely a trend (in het, femslash, and gen, too), and it’s awful. Ignoring actual gay characters, though, is not something I would call a trend. It happens occasionally, but for the most part queer characters are embraced by fandom. Just look at the huge amounts of fanfic written about Kurt and Blaine from Glee, Brian and Justin from Queer as Folk, Jack Harkness from Doctor Who/Torchwood, etc.

    “Teen Wolf is a perfect example of this with the main character not being white”

    Teen Wolf is actually a terrible example of this. The lead actor may be Latino, but the show seems to be coding the main character as white. (Compare to the Latino James Roday playing the white Shawn Spencer on Psych.) Also, he’s been canonically paired with another character for pretty much the entire show…and in fact Scott/Allison is the second most popular Teen Wolf ship. Better examples would be the paucity of fanfiction about Gus from Psych, Rhodey from Iron Man, Troy and Abed from Community, Turk from Scrubs, and Warrick from CSI.

    “there also tends to be doses of misogyny thrown in as well and the fact that it is much rarer to see fans writing about female slash in comparison”

    Hmm, yes and no. There’s a lot of misogyny to be found in various m/m slash communities. But there’s a lot of misogyny to be found in various het communities, as well; it’s not something unique to m/m slash fiction.

    And I think the low amount of femslash has at least as much to do with the paucity of female characters in TV shows and movies–and especially of female characters who actually interact with each other; Google “Bechdel test” to find more in-depth discussions of this problem–as it does with fannish misogyny. It’s not a coincidence that the big femslash fandoms are shows like Once Upon a Time, Xena: Warrior Princess, Star Trek: Voyager, Rizzoli & Isles, and Legend of the Seeker.

  • Maiasaura

    But what if there really could be a gay Avenger? It *is* possible to reimagine characters outside of the straight-white-dude “norm” and still have a successful mainstream product. Elementary? Hit network TV show. Watson is an Asian woman, and Ms. Hudson is trans*. If that can work, then why can’t we also have movies and shows that embrace and engage their gay audiences, instead of just begrudgingly “allowing” them to play in the sandbox?

  • Maiasaura

    I don’t think it makes sense to say that who a character sleeps with is irrelevant. Is it “sexualizing” Peter Parker unnecessarily to know that he spent years pining for Mary Jane, and eventually married her? Or is that a really important part of his characterization? If it’s not important, then why was there such a huge backlash when Marvel retconned their marriage?

  • Kizmet

    Except Holmes did feel strongly about Watson and strongly disliked sharing Watson with his wife:

    “It was worth a wound – it was worth many wounds – to know the depth of loyalty and love which lay behind that cold mask. The clear, hard eyes were dimmed for a moment, and the firm lips were shaking. For the one and only time I caught a glimpse of a great heart as well as of a great brain.” – The Three Garridebs ACD

    “The good Watson had at that time deserted me for a wife, the only selfish action which I can recall in our association. I was alone.” – The Blanched Soldier ACD

    Even if the original cannon Holmes isn’t an emotionless robot.

  • batGRRRl4ever

    There ARE two gay Young Avengers, Wiccan & Hulkling, who are a gay male couple. But the Avengers movie was WAAAAAY at the very start of the team’s existence movie wise, and the Young Avengers don’t come into existence until WAAAAAY later.

  • Jimmy

    Personally I think anyone who spends a lot of time fantasizing and writing about fictional characters’ sexual exploits, be it heterosexual, homosexual, or even bestial needs to seriously get their heads examined and get a f&cking life.
    Am I prudish? Not in the slightest – but time spent writing, drawing, or even staring at Kirk sucking off Spock, Superman giving it to Wonder Woman, or even goddamn Rocket Raccoon spooning Gamora is a waste of time.
    Get a life, get a girlfriend, boyfriends, plant, whatever, but try to use your life more productively.

  • aliablack

    *snort* Oh, please. And exactly what are your hobbies, Jimmy? What do you spend your free time doing, besides reading articles about comic book characters on the internet?

  • Joe S. Walker

    Two of the worst Holmes stories as evidence?

  • demoncat_4

    besides fans have been making up stories with these characters for ages not only using their imaginations even though most are of the romantic side the type that will never really happen with the characters. as long as they don’t totatly change the character or wind up where fans only think of the character or know it from the fan fic or also do something like two gay characters deciding one is straight alll of a sudden there really is nothing wrong with fan fic its just some one being creative

  • http://www.facebook.com/dfullam David Fullam

    I agree, Slash is one hell of a good guitarist! :)

  • AM ST

    Check your statistics. Slash is predominantly written by straight women and read by straight women and therefore a phenomenon looked upon with great interest in psychological and cultural studies.

  • Maiasaura

    This is a good point. Since the movies don’t follow comics canon exactly, and since the Avengers team is now founded, a Young Avengers movie would be a great opportunity for Marvel because the Young Avengers are such a diverse team in so many ways. But instead we’re getting an Ant Man movie.

  • Ha ha

    In my experience slash is predominantly written by people who can stick their hand down someone’s pants and be happy with what they find there no matter what it is, as is the majority of decent fanfiction.

  • http://twitter.com/yellwsn0w Hank

    Fan fiction’s can be a sensitive topic especially from people who have official ties to a property. If a creative were to openly acknowledged they read fanfics, they open themselves to potential accusations of plagerism

  • http://www.facebook.com/people/Micah-李-文-Jung/100000482007095 Micah 李 文 Jung

    Hope it happens but I doubt it will. What with main stream audiences and the west Baptist Boro church going at it

  • http://www.facebook.com/people/Micah-李-文-Jung/100000482007095 Micah 李 文 Jung

    Turd alberts not all gays are flaming queens like kurt which the gay community has had since day one. I want a straight acting gay character that you wouldnt suspect at all

  • http://www.facebook.com/people/Micah-李-文-Jung/100000482007095 Micah 李 文 Jung

    But with gay relationships its expected to have certain things invovled and if they are not met there not gay! Even though that could be the farthest thing from the truth

  • http://www.facebook.com/people/Micah-李-文-Jung/100000482007095 Micah 李 文 Jung

    what bisexuality? the person who says that doesnt have fulfilling relationships until they choose there sexual preferences

  • Jimmy

    Dude that’s not a “hobby.” It’s what they call “maladaptive behaviour.” you need therapy.
    My hobbies? Reading comics and books, bush walking, riding my bike, going to the beach, having dinner with friends etc. In fact I’m just about to go out and have dinner and see a movie with my wife.
    But feel free to “snort” as much as possible when you spend the next two hours jerking off to that Kirk/ Spock Slash pic. I’ll let you know how good the film was when I get back.

  • aliablack

    Yes, because people who write and read fanfiction spend ALL of their time doing that, and couldn’t possibly have, you know, other hobbies, and things like friends, spouses, and children. Or, you know, jobs and a social life. Maladaptive behavior? You’ve got a really bizarre idea of what other people supposedly do with their lives in your little world. Yes, we all live in our parents’ basements and spend hours “jerking off.” I am snorting, because you’re ridiculously small minded and ignorant in classifying a group of people you know absolutely nothing about, not to mention presuming we’re all exactly the same. Here’s a hint: We’re not.

    My husband is laughing at you, too, and since you’re so concerned, wants you to know that our sex life is excellent, thanks. Enjoy your movie. We’re off to bed. :)

  • RaikoLives

    Incorrect. Bisexuality exists. Learn to deal with it. Gender and Sexual fluidity are real and no amount of denying their existence can change that.

  • Jimmy

    Yeah, a lot of people with maladaptive behaviour laugh at those critical of their lifestyle choices. It’s called a “defence mechanism” or “denial.”
    I don’t really have any concerns about you or your life whatsoever. But if you are this defensive about your “lifestyle choices” and the level of maladaptive behaviour associated with it, I suggest you seek help.
    To tell the truth, I’m not laughing at you, your husband, or your maladaptive behaviour. The only thing I feel is pity for you. Many people with maladaptive behaviours like yours (like people obsessed with porn) have no idea how bizarre their behaviour is. If you feel so proud about your choice, raise it a work tomorrow at lunch with your co-workers and see how they react. That will be a good indicator.

  • Jimmy

    Oh and we saw Warm Bodies. It was pretty good. Probably not enough necrophilia for you, but each to their own.

  • aliablack

    Oh, my God. You’re actually serious with this? Well thanks for the armchair psychology diagnosis. Defensive? “Lifestyle choices”? You know, one of us needs some help, predominantly in the education department, and I assure you it isn’t me. Although this obsession you seem to have with porn and how people interact with it is a little disturbing. Repressed much?

    Lesson number one: There are hobbies we share with our friends, families, and co-workers, and there are some we share only with our close family and friends but don’t share with people like our co-workers — not because we’re ashamed or because the hobby or behavior is shaming, but because it’s merely inappropriate.

    Ever heard of the notion of TMI? Do you discuss your sex life in detail with your co-workers? Do you tell them all of your thoughts and ideas about every single comic book – or book, or movie, or television show – you consume? Do you ever find someone attractive or appealing on any level and shout out this revelation to the world? Do you randomly diagnose your friends, family, and co-workers with the same ignorance and vocality, or is that only reserved for anonymous encounters with strangers on the internet?

    Lesson number two: Fandom, fanfiction, and fanart is NOT all about porn. There’s plenty of overlap, sure, but you clearly have no knowledge of anything fandom-related, so you’d do well to keep your ignorance and armchair diagnoses to yourself.

    Lesson number three: There’s nothing wrong with enjoying sex, provided it’s consensual. There’s nothing shameful about having sexual fantasies, and there’s nothing wrong with having an imagination. When those activities intrude into someone’s ability to have a “normal” life – for values of normal that I assure you go beyond your own small-minded definition – then yes, it can become a problem, but FFS, liking sex, or porn, as you seem to quantify it, is not “maladaptive.”

    Oh, and for the record, my husband, my parents, my siblings (and their significant others), along with several of my friends and even co-workers whom I consider good friends know all about my fanfiction hobbies. Some of them even read my stories. (A few of them tried to get me to read the “50 Shades of Grey” trilogy, but I wasn’t interested because I find it to be bad writing and even poorer storytelling. Or are you going to start in on how anyone who read them also suffers from maladaptive behavior, too? Question – in the comics you read, how are the females presented, appearance wise? Or are you going to tell me they’re not predominantly drawn with enormous breasts and tight clothes that show a lot of cleavage? Do you not find that titillating? Or are you going to engage in denial? Hmmm, clearly a symptom of something larger poisoning your psyche!)

    Obviously you have a lot to learn about the world outside your little bubble.

  • aliablack

    You went to see – and enjoyed – a romantic zombie movie, and you’re throwing necrophilia back at ME? Oh, the irony. And really – necro? Because that’s such a widely enjoyed kink … Not. Well, maybe it is in zombie fandom, but you know, not my thing. We were in NYC over the weekend for the Tribeca FF, but we only saw two documentaries and two indie films. Clearly I’m missing out on the “good stuff.”

  • http://www.facebook.com/people/Micah-李-文-Jung/100000482007095 Micah 李 文 Jung

    and you will float all the time and then minimized Homosexuality.